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From: martinottmann@yahoo.com (Martin Ottmann)
Newsgroups: alt.religion.scientology
Subject: Re: kids
Date: 31 Oct 2003 15:02:45 -0800
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martinottmann@yahoo.com (Martin Ottmann) wrote in message news:< 71d327bb.0310301352.2b8913e5@posting.google.com>...

> > And I say that in their totality and in specifics they serve
> > Scientology's malevolent purposes.
> >
> > Let's go back to the Bob Minton example. No, let's choose someone who
> > is in a more equivalent position or status to me in relation to
> > Scientology, for example, Ken Dandar. Dandar is engaged in a huge
> > on-going case against the cult. So am I. Dandar is an attorney. I am
> > my own attorney. So there's a reasonable parallel between us in our
> > relation to Scientology, at least in the legal area.
> >
> > Now let's say that a group of people made two hundred ninety or so
> > posts in which they accused Dandar of being, among other nasty lies, a
> > coward, insane, a kook, a despicable liar, a fake Christian,
> > anti-Semitic, a true moron, a brainwashed zombie, a leader of
> > sycophants, a cultist, dull and simple, delusional, cynical and
> > dishonest, and they charged that what Dandar's doing constitutes hate,
> > that he's a down and out celebrity seeker, that the authorities should
> > be alerted about his travels, that his "logic" meets none of the
> > minimal standards to so qualify, that he writes demented nut rants,
> > that he's quite a pro when it comes to chomping and swallowing, that
> > the Lisa McPherson website is no more than a product of Dandar's
> > fertile paranoia, that his writing sounds like he's syphilitic, that
> > if in a cubicle with Dandar and someone else it would be best to
> > choose Dandar and then shoot him, and that the solution for Dandar is
> > a loaded weapon, bullet and a red dot on his head at the nearest
> > sewage facility. Would you say it's complete bullshit that these
> > statements could serve the cult's malevolent purposes toward Ken
> > Dandar?
>
> It depends if these people are connected to Scientology and their
> allegations are part of an OSA operation. Here is a nice example for
> that, where Dandar just fits in:
>
> SP Times from April 20th, 2002:] [...] On Friday, Minton, one of
> Scientology's most vocal critics, sat in court and testified for the
> church in a related case. "Mr. Dandar is a lying thief," Minton said,
> hitting his fist on the witness box. [...]
>
> In this case I totally agree with you: Minton is serving OSA's
> purposes. I assume, per your logic, you agree with me on this one,
> correct?

And just to make sure that I understand you correctly, here is an
example where your theory doesn't match mine:

De: Bob Minton (bob@minton.org)
Objet: Re: Bob Minton's expenditure - open contest
Groupes de discussion: alt.religion.scientology
Date: 1999/09/27

On 27 Sep 1999 16:01:29 -0400, Karl Kluge
<kckluge@yarf.eecs.umich.edu> wrote:

>Bob Minton <bob@minton.org> writes:
>
>> When you walk like an OSA Whore, talk like an OSA Whore and act
>> like an OSA Whore, Diane, don't be surprised that many believe you
>> are indeed an OSA Whore.
>
>You know, you throw the word "whore" around with suprising casualness
for a
>man who was screwing the current love of his life while you were both
married
>to other people.

Speaking of an OSA Whore, Mr. Kluge arrives! You're one of the
"Loyalists"
who pretended to be a disaffected Scientologist and along with Rinder
and a few
other OSA whores approached Gerry Armstrong for help in fucking
Miscavige. Was
that in 1990, in Griffith's Park while Gene Ingram videotaped the
whole sorid
affair over several weeks? Do I have the right OSA Whore Kluge?

I thought so.

Bob Minton [end of post]

In this case I argue that Minton's allegation didn't serve
Scientology's malevolent purposes, instead he was merely following his
own twisted but purely personal purposes, as at that time Minton was
certainly not *connected* to Scientology.

But according to your own standards you will tell me in your next
reply that such "an unmerited attack by someone who professes to be a
critic" (Minton) against an "opponent of Scientology" (Karl Kluge) did
indeed "serve the organization's malevolent purposes", correct?

Please note that in this case Minton did not state a mere opinion but
an actual *claim* that was utterly false and that was proven wrong by
no other person than you:

De: gerry armstrong (armstrong@dowco.com)
Objet: Re: Bob Minton's expenditure - open contest
Groupes de discussion: alt.religion.scientology
Date: 1999/09/28

On Mon, 27 Sep 1999 17:14:45 -0400, Bob Minton <bob@minton.org> wrote:

[...]

>Speaking of an OSA Whore, Mr. Kluge arrives! You're one of the
"Loyalists"
>who pretended to be a disaffected Scientologist and along with Rinder
and a few
>other OSA whores approached Gerry Armstrong for help in fucking
Miscavige.

That OSA whore was Dave Kluge.

>Was
>that in 1990, in Griffith's Park while Gene Ingram videotaped the
whole sorid
>affair over several weeks?

That was in November, 1984 in Griffith Park in LA.

>Do I have the right OSA Whore Kluge?

I think this Karl Kluge is not Dave Kluge. And my guess is Karl is not
a $cientologist. Karl has made a few posts recently to ars. Perhaps he
will tell us all about himself.

(c) Gerry Armstrong [end of post]

 
 

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